Thursday, January 07, 2021

ANS -- FB conversation on today's insurrection

Here's a conversation from Facebook on today's insurrection:

--Kim


As awful as this is, take heart. This is how Trumpism ends.
The crazier it gets, the more Americans will jump off the Trump bandwagon. We saw Mitch McConnell start to pull his punches this morning. Doubtless a lot of other Congressional Republicans are feeling the fear today; and some may be sheltered inside the Capitol, seriously re-thinking the wisdom of supporting the Trump agenda.
A lot of Trump followers -- the ones who believe in law and order and playing by the rules -- will be leaving the cult this week. Law enforcement has been put on notice that they're no longer part of the movement.
And Americans more generally -- even the ones who haven't paid much attention -- will look at this scene and recoil. The MAGAts have promised more days of rage, and no doubt those are coming. But every statehouse they bust up, every moment of tape we see with them breaking windows and storming public buildings, will cost them mass support. Americans HATE this shit. Political violence is the fastest, surest way to discredit your movement. Now that they've gone there, they're going to be surprised at how fast anybody who considers themselves even marginally respectable will yank their support.
Remember this, too: From Vietnam through BLM, leftists have never brought guns to these demonstrations. It's only the right that does that. That's an essential difference between us and them -- and one that needs to be driven home to any right-wing grognard who dares to to accuse the left of "violence" going forward.
Whatever we might have done -- even in the darkest days of the Vietnam War -- we never did anything remotely like this. Who's worse? There's no longer even a debate.

Sara Robinson
Nobody in America can be for this. Certainly nobody with money or power -- the likes of Hawley and Cruz are going to lose their big corporate donors over this. Law enforcement gets off at this exit; the military got off at the last one. Evangelical leaders can't be having this, either. Nobody who owns a business or property, who relies on civic order, can endorse Trumpism any more.
That's why some commentators are talking about the end of the GOP. People with money and power value order and stability above all else. A party that fails to deliver that will lose their support. The GOP has failed. The power structure recognizes that Biden is now their best hope for restoring order, and the Democrats the people most invested in maintaining the system. That's how political allegiances change.
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  • Suzanne Turner
    I watched the military get off at the DC summer protest stop. That's when I breathed a little easier. Also when we didn't have today's version of violence at the polling places. If we can make it to Jan 20th (and we will) we will be okay to do the hard work of cleaning up this mess.
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  • David Clow
    It won't just "end". There's money and power in it for the hard core Trumpists. Those with less passion and more brains, the Cruzites, just change color and move a little on the spectrum, but we can't forget that this for some people is about all-in passion and fun. We're seeing pro-Trump rallies all over Southern California, and those can't be the only ones happening across the country. So it needs to be stopped the way cancers are stopped, by close detection and cutting off its sustenance. The firms smeared by Fox and by Trump's lawyers need to sue aggressively The dark money needs to be disclosed, tracked, and forced into the light or penalized. The true believers in the think tanks and the megachurches have to be seen and confronted for it. There's a vacuum on the Right that's extremely dangerous and nothing is going to just happen for the right reasons.
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  • Sara Robinson
    David, after today, I don't think the money will be with them. Money despises disorder. Nobody with a fiduciary duty can be happy about this.
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  • David Clow
    Sara Robinson
     I'd love to think you're right but as we're seeing, this Proud Boy stuff doesn't require a whole lot of capital. I want the idea that dark money equals speech to stopped from the SCOTUS down. If someone wants to donate, fine; but political speech should be with a name and a face on it. Fomenting dissent is also a great way to self-promote and score big, as the likes of Jenny Beth Martin show. It doesn't need to be big money investing here; it just needs to be lots and lots of ones and fives.
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  • Sara Robinson
    Suzanne Turner
     Agree. I was thrilled that Milley told Trump to fuck right off last summer. We were in the middle of their first little experiment with unbadged goons here in Seattle at that moment, and feeling freedom slipping away by the second. Milley made us feel a whole lot better.


    Other bits of the conversation, not in order: 
  • Suzanne Turner



    My most conservative friends' social media feeds have gone completely anti-Trump today. These are people who were posting violent "target practice" memes this summer during the protests.

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